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On 13/02/2017 13:58, Neil via list wrote: > On 13/02/17 13:46, Grant Phillips-Sewell wrote: > >> >> >> It depends really on the interest level of the individual. I would say >> that a "good" setup for someone looking to migrate to Linux would be one >> where initially their other operating system is still available, but not >> immediately so. A quick change to the GRUB menu so it goes straight into >> Linux rather then presenting a menu. They would still be able to boot >> into their other operating system by rebooting and holding the Shift key >> so the GRUB menu is presented, but don't necessarily tell them that >> off-the-bat. My reasoning is that if people can see that they have an >> easy escape route when something becomes slightly taxing, then they'll >> take it again and again. Completely obliterating their existing >> operating system is an option, but simply making the escape route less >> easy can help. > > My idea for an escape route is to keep Linux on a separate machine. > >> >> I would personally recommend giving someone a distro that is well >> supported by the community and that you are familiar with. Ubuntu tends >> to be my distro of choice for this, despite being a Debian user myself. >> One of the key things the user should understand is that there is a >> /choice/. If they find that they like to dig around and change things up >> a bit, then they are more than welcome to do so... but for the sake of >> getting them up to speed with using the system, I prefer Ubuntu. > > And Xubuntu is based on Ubuntu. I could not help much with the gnome > desktop as I have never used it. >> > >> >> When you buy a new computer, you normally do not get the opportunity to >> experience the installation part of the process. However many of the >> initial MCSE training courses, and I believe the RHCE training courses >> also frequently start with "installing the system". These days it is >> remarkably easy to do and is very well documents, so there shouldn't >> really be too much standing in the way of doing this. > > Have to decide depending on the trainee. > >> >> Most Windows users know little or nothing about using a terminal >> screen, yet it is so useful and powerful. So what would be the best >> way to get that across? >> >> >> Do they /need/ to use it initially? Too much "wow, isn't this stuff >> powerful" can be a massive turn-off for many. Teach them that the >> environment is different but familiar. When they are ready to progress >> to "the next level" then command line love can be shown. > > Thanks for that advice. No they don't need to use it at first, but I > would introduce it fairly early on. > >> >> I think this would be one of the stumbling blocks to the whole >> scheme. Yet I feel that it is a very important part of the training. >> >> >> That depends on what the training is for. If the training is set out to >> get someone up to speed with managing Linux systems remotely from the >> command line, then absolutely. If the training is set out to get desktop >> users up and running and working in a comfortable environment, then >> maybe give the command line a miss for now? > > Again, something to think about. > >> >> Then the packages. Inevitably my personal likes and dislikes are >> going to come into this. For example, the browser. I hate >> Chrome/Chromium. I think that Firefox has become too bloated, so it >> is installed but rarely used. I do use one called Pale Moon (what FF >> should have become), and also a fairly new one called Vivaldi, which >> is my current favourite. There will be other package examples as >> well, no doubt. Of course, if it is one I Iike then it will be one I >> know well and should be one that I therefore teach well. >> >> >> But what if the trainee doesn't like it? Linux is all about choice, >> after all. Again, I would teach them about the default applications that >> it comes with, teach them about the different choices, and teach them >> how to install other applications. > > Thanks again. More to consider. > > >> >> There are other questions that came to my mind about all this, but I >> don't want to keep on too long. However, one final thought, it would >> not be a good idea, or fair, to set them up and then just leave >> them to it. They will have problems and questions, a fairly steep >> learning curve, so I ought to be available to provide help and >> further training for some time. >> >> I must admit that, when I heard that my friend was moving away, one >> reaction was relief. >> >> >> Are you providing "training" or "support"? The line between the two is >> often blurry. > > I would consider it training, but some support would be needed in the > early days. > >> >> >> Providing training in Linux should not be taken lightly. It is quite >> a commitment. Or, to put it another way, a nightmare. >> >> >> Training indeed can be a nightmare. But then if it was easy, everybody >> would do it and we wouldn't need teachers. >> >> As somebody who runs an IT training business, I can definitely vouch for >> it being a commitment, and one that I made many years ago. >> >> I am always around and happy to discuss teaching and training. >> >> Grant. :) > > Thanks again. I will remember that. Perhaps I will be lucky and no one > else will ask me. > > Neil > > I first LEAVE them on Windows but introduce a Live Puppy Linux CD with their set up stored inside the Windows files. (on restarting to Puppy it picks up the set up and thus is workable on their ISP , email etc). second teach them to select Windows of Puppy by booting from hard disc or CD. Get them used to browsing and other normal things in Puppy, it removes the fear and gets them started also with documents /spreadsheets etc. THEN i introduce them to a full distro as a Live CD but always with XFCE windows manager and computer is usually elderly> My selection is OpenSUSE (due to easy to get then to use YaST) or Linux Mint as starters. One they are happy with a Live Linux then I either dual boot to windows /Linux as a fall back option (usually some are nervous to remove Windows) OR best option provided all old files saved to an external back up a single boot Linux and reload old files into their home folder. This is the difficult part if their photo altering needs Photoshop, as GIMP is an uphill learning curve. (It is also a reason for dual booting) Only two sets or program use are difficult to users (accounts programs with VAT, home accounts no problem) and photos is they have years of use of Photoshop. -- regards Eion MacDonald -- The Mailing List for the Devon & Cornwall LUG https://mailman.dclug.org.uk/listinfo/list FAQ: http://www.dcglug.org.uk/listfaq