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Re: [LUG] Debian (Stable vs Unstable)

 

Simon Waters wrote:
> Neil Williams wrote:
>   
>> On Thu, 2008-11-06 at 13:41 +0000, "Philip Radford" wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> I am keen to utilise the latest versions of Apache and
>>> PHP for my web applications which work in a LAMP environment.
>>>       
>> That is the *wrong* reason to use unstable. 
>>     
>
> Philip,
>
> Is there a specific feature of PHP or Apache that you need which isn't
> in Etch? I think this is the right question.
>
> The point of stable is to ensure that software you
> write/configure/"bundle together" works, and continues to work without
> modification, until that release dies.
>
> Whilst plenty of folks say unstable works, unstable doesn't crash etc,
> this misses the point. Unstable may both break completely (I've had it
> mess up a box to the point where I needed to reinstall hundreds of
> packages to get working again - okay it was only a handful of commands
> but it took many hours to run), or more crucially may break your
> applications by changing something important.
>
> As others have said, this close to releasing Lenny (Testing), where it
> has less critical bugs that Etch (Stable), there is a case for
> installing Lenny (although there is a lot of churn despite the alleged
> freeze). I suspect that most web servers would be better of running Etch
> because if there is a problem, other people will have solved it and
> documented the fix.
>
> MySQL and PHP are in my experience just the kind of things to have
> non-backward compatible changes in unstable, so when thing break you
> find migrating back to a working version means running unstable as it
> was on a specific day (or exporting the database and trying to import
> into an earlier versions of MySQL, or rewriting PHP code), and you lose
> the ability to apply new security related patches until you address the
> relevant issues.
>
> Complex PHP installs likely also want some security work done on them.
>
> Debian (afaik) still installs with a version of the PHP.INI file which
> isn't suitable for use on a live server (think developer version -
> display_errors is on, and the security settings are weak), and you may
> want Suhosin or similar installed. Things like Suhosin will depend on
> the version of PHP, and unstable will likely upgrade PHP and a few days
> later get a compatible Suhosin. Similarly new PHP or MySQL releases may
> need additions to the configuration files (and the php.ini will likely
> be heavily changed by yourself).
>
> I would also try to avoid backports, and other repositories if you can.
> Backports is probably the least painful, but all of these make it harder
> to upgrade when the time comes, and your stable release is no longer
> getting security support. I know I picked up PHP and MySQL from a third
> party repository with Sarge, and ended up having to switch all my PHP
> from mod-php5 to CGI at one point.
>
> Now if you'd said LAPP (Linux, Apache, Postgres and Perl) I might have a
> different view ;)
>
> I don't think the group has a distro of choice. We do have some very
> vocal Debian fans - but hey when you have a good thing and it costs
> nothing to share it....
>
>   
Thanks for your comments and advice on this Neil.

There are no specific features I require other than those provided by 
the default modules.
It was more a case of ensuring that all the security holes were patched. 
Then I read about such patches are released back into previous releases 
so therefore I should be covered.

I also take on board your comments regarding php.ini. I am quite 
paranoid about php and security so my settings are up to speed for a 
production environment.

As per my previous post, I have now reverted to etch and am quite 
content to use the supplied packages unless there is a need to upgrade.

I am keen to look at lenny (testing) but it is not important.

Regards
Phil
Cornwall

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