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Thanks for all the feedback guys (aren't there any gals out there?) Lots of nuggets to mine and incorporate. I have given up on Debian (3.1) for the time being. If you have no GUI installer then you have to use a shell. Too many issues for the time being. I see there is a GUI for APT in Debian 4 but it will have to wait. I too have sat on a phone and walked customers through their problems with windows and it's apps, and I don't think they are stupid. With the hesitant ones it starts with them being terrified to touch the keyboard in case something breaks. But this soon goes and the questions get sensible. And now there are literally millions of users out there who do know their way around Windows. The difficulty is in persuading them to jump through the Linux hoops, no matter how much they dislike the Windows experience and ethos. Too much choice for the simple user probably :-). Since starting this thread I installed Kubuntu 6.1 and royally screwed up my Mepis setup. Hey ho, back to the drawing board. I also notice that that the next release of Ubuntu, frig-about fawn or something, will contain many more proprietary drivers to ease us beginners lot. They are, naturally, being slated for sullying the purity of GNU Linux dih dah dih dah dih dah.. I come down on the side of those who follow open source where possible, but hey, life's too short to be an angel, that comes next. (So many pubs, so little time.) Software I forgot and didn't get a mention is Family History apps. I am trying Gramps, which seems to be the only kid on the block, and quite enjoying it. It has come a long way in a couple of years. Much simpler than The Master Genealogist but that may not be a bad thing. I'm not a professional genealogist and you can spend too much time playing with app and not the data, and TMG aren't interested in open source. And the one big thing that is still stopping me switching off my XP install is that I can't get Desktop Sudoku running in Linux. It's for my wife you understand, not me. She is addicted. This was why I tried Wine which I have got working with some things. But Desktop Sudoku has a space in the name which you can get around manually but I think the install programme puts in the space and screws up Wine. And I can't find a replacement programme as good. Anybody looking for a project?... So back to Mepis to get it working to actually do some work rather than this quite addictive distro hopping. Although you do learn from it, if only you can remember what you learn. BTW, I find the online magazine TUX great for my level of experience, very desktop orientated. See you all at the get together tomorrow George -- The Mailing List for the Devon & Cornwall LUG http://mailman.dclug.org.uk/listinfo/list FAQ: http://www.dcglug.org.uk/linux_adm/list-faq.html Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com -- The Mailing List for the Devon & Cornwall LUG http://mailman.dclug.org.uk/listinfo/list FAQ: http://www.dcglug.org.uk/linux_adm/list-faq.html