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On Tue, 11 Sep 2007 15:06:25 +0100 Mark Jose <kernowyon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > On Tuesday 11 September 2007 14:46, Ben Goodger wrote: > > > You _can_ do that. > > People just need to get through their thick skulls that Ubuntu is > > Debian plus a load of crappy hacks, and a centimetre-thick layer of > > Canonical on top. > > That is *your* view Ben - to which of course, you are entitled. I > won't bother arguing, but I do not agree with it. You might not agree with *how* Ben expressed the reality but it doesn't change the fact that Ubuntu is a series of layers and patches on top of some arbitrary 'state' between testing and unstable and a few extra packages most of which aren't good enough for Debian. (After packaging a number of Ubuntu packages that were trying to get into Debian, I can say with some experience that Ubuntu-only packages commonly include non-free code (according to the DFSG), unlicenced code, illegally distributed code, poor code, non-portable code and a very small number of gems.) I find it personally very frustrating that the rapid release cycles of Ubuntu lead to bugs in Debian packages actually being RETAINED because Ubuntu is in a package freeze so *damn* often! My own packages are several versions ahead of the imminent Ubuntu release and won't be updated now. Releases take time and the package list has to be frozen during the stabilisation process. These frequent freezes make upgrading between releases more difficult because so many transitions happen in Debian that are on a completely different timescale. This is inevitable in how Ubuntu and Debian operate. Ubuntu is a great introduction but, IMHO, it is not a wise long-term choice. A rolling distribution like Debian testing or stable (rather than following the codenames) is a better option for many users. Upgrades are painful and worth avoiding. (It's why I switched from Mandrake originally.) > Arguments about which distro is best are simply pandering to the > Microsoft camp. Yes, we probably all have our views about Novell or > Xandros or whoever - but each distro has its own strengths and > weaknesses and which is "best" is purely down to the user and their > needs. True, but the origin of Ubuntu is neither a matter of "strength or weakness" nor a matter of personal opinion. My view of Ubuntu is that the graphical installer is overdone and desperately needs some increased memory efficiency. The threads here have testified that Knoppix and others can do a GUI installer in less memory and Ubuntu need to take that on board - fast. -- Neil Williams ============= http://www.data-freedom.org/ http://www.nosoftwarepatents.com/ http://www.linux.codehelp.co.uk/
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