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I agree that M$ Visual Studio is good. It is their best product (I can't think of anything else of theirs that I rate). However, these days I tend to either be using Python, with vim and print / log to debug, or doing embedded C/C++ work on eg. ARM targets. You can get remote debug IDE tools (I used Visual Studio to remotely debug a couple of years ago with OnTime's RTOS32, which was helpful), but it ends to be back to syslog and print / printk. So I hardly use IDEs these days. They come into their own on big C++ applications. Tracing through someone else's code is a good way of finding out how it all works, especially when you don't have time to read 100,000 lines of code. Discovery. I'd be interested to know what people study at University these days. I've always preferred working with Physics or Electronics people, as Comp Sci seems to put funny ideas into people's heads in this country. I've worked with a few great Comp Scis from the US, but the best people I've worked with here have almost all been Physicists, and none of them CompScis. The problem with software development is that people get caught up with the technology, forgetting that the purpose is to solve the problem, not to be clever. I recently came across this with a contractor I was working with (a Cambridge Phd) who put together a proposal that looked just like an OOD C++ paper from 1997. Unfortunately it was completely inappropriate to the language (Python), and solved a problem we didn't have. 10 out of 10 for command of OOD. 0 out of 10 for addressing the problem. You don't need to reinvent COM's query interface when you have a language with built in reflection. My advice would be - do Physics. Perhaps it leads to a bottom up understanding of the system. CS seems to try and impose a top down view. D On Sunday 11 November 2007 16:13:37 Simon Williams wrote: > Tom Potts wrote: > > On Sunday 11 November 2007 00:22, Simon Williams wrote: > > ... > > > >> The CS department here only has Linux machines (admittedly with CentOS, > >> but you can't have everything), which is very very useful. Unlike most > >> Universities they start with C and work up, and everything can be done > >> with command line programs, rather than force the use of visual studio > >> or some other IDE, which is definitely better. Those IDEs that are > >> available are decent (i.e. open source, cross platform) ones. > > > > I'd be interested to hear which ones are in use! > > I've never managed to get any real consistency with Linux IDE's: > > I last coded in C# using Visual Studio and, much as I hate M$, it still > > stands out as the best IDE for any serious work - they do like their > > coders to be productive even if they don't mind them writing complete > > tosh! > > > > Eclipse looks like it should be useful but all I ever get are dependency > > problems - it is apparently possible to set it up to debug PHP on Apache > > but I've never managed to come close. > > FreeRides OK but primitive. > > KDevelop just seems to not work when you need it.... > > I haven't actually tried using any so far, I've just been sticking to > command line tools. Mainly Eclipse I think. However, even if all of them > suck and Visual Studio is the only good one it doesn't run on my system > so I'm not using it (wine doesn't count, though I'm sure they've got it > running very nicely). -- The Mailing List for the Devon & Cornwall LUG http://mailman.dclug.org.uk/listinfo/list FAQ: http://www.dcglug.org.uk/linux_adm/list-faq.html