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Oh and apparently gdm has a debug option in defaults.conf (cough urm /etc/gdm/gdm.conf) - never knew that - sounds like it might be useful. Simon Section reading [debug] should read [debug] Enable=true If you want to try it. -- The Mailing List for the Devon & Cornwall LUG http://mailman.dclug.org.uk/listinfo/list FAQ: http://www.dcglug.org.uk/listfaq